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Poster: sydthecat Date: Dec 12, 2006 11:50am
Forum: GratefulDead Subject: Althea Debate

Here's the last stanza complete from The Complete Annotated Grateful Dead Lyrics:

I told Althea
I'm a roving sign---
that I was born to be a bachelor---
Althea told me: Okay that's fine---
So now I'm trying to catch her

Can't talk to you without talking to me
We're guilty of the same old thing
Talking a lot about less and less
And forgetting the love we bring.

It sounds to me that they're still apart, he's realized his error, and that he's going to find her. In short his has had a revelation of self, about what he needs in his life and has been avoiding. But it's all up to interpretation and certainly one's own experience colours everything.


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Poster: johnnyonthespot Date: Dec 12, 2006 1:56pm
Forum: GratefulDead Subject: Re: Althea Debate

I have never heard one version where it wasn't sung " we're guilty of the same OFFENSE"

What I get out of this is primarily the guy is wandering, unsure of what he wants, wanting out but not totally making up his mind, etc. and she is playing it cold saying " whatever"

Not really saying this right I know but I thought I got it.

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Poster: JodyC Date: Dec 12, 2006 3:46pm
Forum: GratefulDead Subject: Re: Althea Debate

Would have sworn it was offense also. Thats why I stopped reading the lyrics because I sing almost all the songs in my version. Its so embarrasing, but I read the real lyrics and its like wtf,who would have guessed THAT? Purists, string me up if you'd like.

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Poster: direwolf0701 Date: Dec 12, 2006 4:13pm
Forum: GratefulDead Subject: Re: Althea Debate

Jody - got the discs - thanks very much man! very much appreciated my friend :)

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Poster: JodyC Date: Dec 12, 2006 4:17pm
Forum: GratefulDead Subject: Re: Althea Debate

That was speedy as they just went out Saturday. Go usps during the holidays!Its funny, I had it on with my daughter, and she asked who it was. I said the Dead and even she commented the recording sounded different than most. Not bad, but def different.

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Poster: direwolf0701 Date: Dec 12, 2006 4:21pm
Forum: GratefulDead Subject: Re: Althea Debate

damn that WAS speedy since my office wife said it was delivered yesterday, not today (i was there today). wow!!!! [pretty impressive.

thanks man - owe you one :)

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Poster: JodyC Date: Dec 12, 2006 5:06pm
Forum: GratefulDead Subject: Re: Althea Debate

Do you have 9/19/70?

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Poster: direwolf0701 Date: Dec 12, 2006 5:08pm
Forum: GratefulDead Subject: Re: Althea Debate

unfortunately no - have very little from '70 for some reason (not sure why). why, you looking for that one Jody? (By the way - your Rams looked better than my Pats - what the hell happened?? Pats are looking mighty grim)

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Poster: high flow Date: Dec 12, 2006 5:32pm
Forum: GratefulDead Subject: Re: Althea Debate

I've been seeking 9-19-70 as well. It's a tough little bugger....

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Poster: JodyC Date: Dec 12, 2006 5:47pm
Forum: GratefulDead Subject: Re: Althea Debate

9-4 takes some of the heat off 5-8. I'll see what a 9/19/70 thread yields.

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Poster: johnnyonthespot Date: Dec 12, 2006 6:31pm
Forum: GratefulDead Subject: Re: Althea Debate

Right on! Someone else heard it that way too. Makes me feel more sane. Thanks.

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Poster: direwolf0701 Date: Dec 12, 2006 4:10pm
Forum: GratefulDead Subject: Re: Althea Debate

always sounded like "old thing" to me live and on tape - time for me to go back and listen

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Poster: JodyC Date: Dec 12, 2006 4:13pm
Forum: GratefulDead Subject: Re: Althea Debate

You sound like an old thing to me- ha!

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Poster: direwolf0701 Date: Dec 12, 2006 4:25pm
Forum: GratefulDead Subject: Re: Althea Debate

feel like it too - believe me

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Poster: Max Chorak Date: Dec 12, 2006 2:11pm
Forum: GratefulDead Subject: Re: Althea Debate

Johnny, I always thought garcia said "offense" too, but IIRC it is "old thing" :X

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Poster: johnnyonthespot Date: Dec 12, 2006 2:49pm
Forum: GratefulDead Subject: Re: Althea Debate

what's IIRC?

I'm going to listen again, I'm still sticking with what I've been hearing for all these years

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Poster: direwolf0701 Date: Dec 12, 2006 4:19pm
Forum: GratefulDead Subject: Re: Althea Debate

Dick Picks 32 (cant remember the year since i have it on hd) is definintely "old thing" - just listened

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Poster: JodyC Date: Dec 12, 2006 3:45pm
Forum: GratefulDead Subject: Re: Althea Debate

if i remember correctly (thanks max)

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Poster: wineland Date: Dec 12, 2006 2:59pm
Forum: GratefulDead Subject: Re: Althea Debate

Just did a sampling of a couple Altheas (12.5.79, 5.15.80, 8.28.81, 9.25.81, 4.18.82 - all recomendations of the Taping Compendium v2). Each said "old thing," although I can see how it can be misinterpreted. The one thing I did notice is Garcia mixes up the original lyrics "Can't talk to me without talking to you" and makes it "Can't talk to YOU without talking to ME." Seems true for all his songs. He gets what he thinks is right into his head and that is how it sticks. I seem to remember reading Hunter saying the same thing.

BTW - Check out 5.15.80 & 4.18.82. Both are nice AUDS and the Altheas are delightful.

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Poster: johnnyonthespot Date: Dec 12, 2006 3:29pm
Forum: GratefulDead Subject: Re: Althea Debate

Wow really? Same meaning but still, I swear that's what I heard. On another note I know for a FACT that Jerry once and awhile sang " some MOTHER fuckers crime" instead of " some other fuckers crime"

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Poster: wineland Date: Dec 12, 2006 3:34pm
Forum: GratefulDead Subject: Re: Althea Debate

I like it when they mix up the words a bit, in fact I listen for it. It kept the crowd on their toes and was probably satisfying to have a little joke here and there.

My favorite is Jack Straw just after they signed with Arista. I've heard a few shows where Bobby is supposed to sing "We used to play for silver, now we play for life" and he switches it up to "We used to play for silver, now we play for Clive." Clive as in Clive Davis the owner of Arista.

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Poster: HiRoller Date: Dec 12, 2006 6:03pm
Forum: GratefulDead Subject: Re: Althea Debate

"On another note I know for a FACT that Jerry once and awhile sang 'some MOTHER fuckers crime' instead of 'some other fuckers crime'"

It actually seems like he said "mother fuckers crime" more often than "some other fuckers," but it might just be the way he sings. It does seem like he stresses the sound at the end of some so it could be argued that he's saying both at the same time.

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Poster: johnnyonthespot Date: Dec 12, 2006 6:07pm
Forum: GratefulDead Subject: Re: Althea Debate

I usually hear some OTHER but there's a 77 show I was listening to a few weeks where it was clear as a bell. I even rewinded it like three times and sure enough.


On that Althea line - holy smokes! Plain as day " we're guilty of the same old thing" how could I have heard it so wrong all these years?

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Poster: direwolf0701 Date: Dec 12, 2006 4:09pm
Forum: GratefulDead Subject: Re: Althea Debate

impossible to tell with that though - that is why Hunter wrote it that way - a bit of the ol' tongue in cheek

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Poster: Max Chorak Date: Dec 12, 2006 12:53pm
Forum: GratefulDead Subject: Re: Althea Debate

Maybe it's like... they love eachother, but they can't be together? Hmm..

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Poster: patkelley Date: Dec 12, 2006 2:57pm
Forum: GratefulDead Subject: Re: Althea Debate

I always thought that it was "old thing" also, but "offense" makes sense in light of the person being guilty of something.

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Poster: direwolf0701 Date: Dec 12, 2006 4:12pm
Forum: GratefulDead Subject: Re: Althea Debate

within the context of the song - they both really "mean" the same thing imho

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Poster: ducats Date: Dec 12, 2006 3:09pm
Forum: GratefulDead Subject: Re: Althea Debate

it's "old thing" - u people will debate anything - advocating both sides have a right to their opinion regardless - it's actually pretty sad

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Poster: sydthecat Date: Dec 12, 2006 3:08pm
Forum: GratefulDead Subject: Re: Althea Debate

Hunter wrote the introduction to the book. My wife always hears "that was a fact" instead of "knife in the back" in He's gone and still sings the line when we're listening to it. I've never corrected her in twenty years and I'm wishing I never corrected johnnyonthespot.

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